TCM for Pediatrics

When children get sick, not only the children suffer from it but the parents also. With traditional Chinese medicine(TCM), how can parents help their sick children. We are please to have Dr. Lucy Hu to give us some TCM tips on pediatrics.There is a different set of measure when making a TCM diagnosis for children. Children’s blood and Qi is not fully developed yet, so they get blood and qi deficiency easily and get sick. In addition, their channel or the heart vessel is not developed yet, so it may also cause some problems with channel or blood vessel and make them sick. If children get sick, their syndromes change quickly. A TCM practitioner’s job is to follow the children’s conditions, in order to make correct diagnosis and treatment plan.


Hi, welcome to the class. My name is Lucy Hu. I’m a faculty member of Five Branches University. I am very honored to be invited to give you guys a brief talk about traditional Chinese medicine for Pediatrics.

00:03 Speaker 1: So, we need little by little understand what is different adult, right? Firstly, we thinking the anatomy, how different adult anatomy different adult. And the pathogenic different adult and the physiologic is different adult. Some nutrition diet, different adult. Or the metabolism, different adult. How to take care, healthy care for the children, different adult. And for treat disease diagnosis and treatment, different adult. We say the pediatrician, traditional Chinese medicine is very independent size, independent size. So, I show you some picture. For example, this picture, for ear. Many children have the ear infection in this country. You look these two picture. One is for adult, one is for children ear. The anatomy, different adult.

01:10 S1: If catch the cold, very common cold, so you… And the five year old children very easy getting ear infection because ear anatomy, the tubes, each tubes, yeah different adult, so they get the common cold. So, very easy, go to the ear. So, how to treat and how to prevention so important. We need to know this knowledge. Okay, next. You see the digestion system, children many digestion problem and digestion… For example is diarrhea or the constipation or the abdomen pain because their digestive system anatomy is different. You look the two pictures, one is adult, one is children. Their position different, size different and the tube open different. So easy make the infant spit out milk or the vomiting or the other disease. Okay, next.

02:20 S1: So, TCM thinking the pediatrician, the physiology different. They say the the qi and the blood, no fullness, no develop yet. So they always easy qi and the blood deficiency, easy make those kind of problem. Other one, they said the channel or the vessel heart is not developed yet. So can make the other channel or blood vessel some problem, too. So the one we say the internal organ and the essential qi, no fullness, so, easy make the, a lot of internal organs disease. Last point, we say the wei qi function is not strong enough, especially how easy get common cold. If weather change or some condition change, they are the first one make the wei qi is low because they are not strong yet. How to make the stronger, so this TCM can take care too.

03:34 S1: Then the other, we say the physiologic different pediatrician. We say they are very easy catch the disease, especially younger one. We say the external factor, for example is weather change, we’re now starting weather change is wind, cold, or heat or dry or fire can make many different seasoned disease. Other reason become easily sick children, we say the internal effect. Internal, we say the five elements. We talk major one, five elements. Five elements, always most deficiency, especially for example, lung, spleen and the kidneys. They are not developed yet, not mature yet, so they always deficiency. So, easy make this organ problem. If we know this knowledge, how to support, make the organ function is better.

04:45 S1: Then that if children is sick, they are very quickly changed. Pediatrician job always follow the children their condition, they change very quickly. They change… for example, they change the deficiency very quickly. If you catch the cold, most wind cold, they change wind heat very quickly too. So this pediatrician need to know. Then if your diagnosis is correct and the treatment is correct, they recover seem like easy, fast, their so good. This different adult. This just look the picture. You see the children growing underdeveloped is for the different age. We can compare thing for the adult from the filter to adult. You see the two months, the filter seem like head, halfway for the whole body.

05:52 S1: You look at 25 year old, you see the adult, you see the head, only maybe when five of this that developed very quickly, follow the different age. Okay. Next. Then we talked the pediatrician problem, starting mommy pregnant, the filter starting. We have the six period. Because different age, different problem. For example, filter disappeared, mommy pregnant, we need prevention many disease during this time. Especially first three months, we need to take care of mom. How to take care of the pregnant people, how to prevention some disease, very important. For example, certain period, we say the new baby, new baby after new, many new baby problem. For example, I just give you the example of skin problem, breathing problem or the jaundice, the infant jaundice.

07:11 S1: Infant jaundice for TCM treat really good, we really simple, yeah. We can give the herb tea mommy can drink, pass the milk give the baby, very quickly control this condition. Don’t need a complicate for Western treatment, and very safe, both sides, mommy or children is very comfortable, very quickly recover. You can see the mommy pregnant, the baby the situation. Okay. Come back to, and other picture. Yeah. Okay. This is a new born period, starting 28 to one month, the baby, their situation is very critical. This my office, patient sometime is twins, sometime ones. Okay, next picture. This my other period, we say one month to one year. This year, this age, different problem, too. Sometimes, it’s after six months, their feeding problem, we need supplement food, not only mommy milk. Okay.

08:27 S1: After six months, mommy give the antibody almost disappeared. The babies have not build it yet, so, easy sick, easy get, yeah, yeah, some infection disease. We need to special take care. And they say it’s easy to have the skin problem. I hold that this baby’s skin problem eczema. After treatment, completely recover. Okay. Okay, next picture. This other period, one month to one year. This baby getting, growing up, they try self-eat or the new teeth coming or they’re gradually standing. But they have other problem, because they easy get the infection, disease this age. Okay, next. These one or two, three year old children, they can standing, they can walking, they can talk. But they still have the, easy get the infection disease or the injury easily, because they move activity more.

09:39 S1: Okay. Next. This is the three or seven year old period children, preschool. They go to the daycare or after seven year old, they go to the regular school. They have other problem, tonsils, also kidney infection disease. Okay, next. This is more big children, yeah. We say that childhood period, seven to 12 year old. They already study, same like yes, as a big children, regular time go to the school. They have the other emotion problem, and still have some infection disease they can get. Okay. Then the how to diagnostic method for the pediatrician, because baby cannot talk with you, especially young baby, no language. If older one, they talk, still not detailed, right? So we use these four technique check the patient. First one important, we said inspection. We need a…

11:02 S1: Doctor need an experience, look the patient very important, look to everywhere, we need to look, head, eyes, mouth, skin, and all that, look the eye, skin color, skin the rash, okay. Everything we need to look, and the diaper, we need to look, too. The eyes inside, something happened, we need everything. So look so important. And the emotion, we can see patient happy, happy, crying, crying, the sounds. Okay, no more sounds, or the sick sounds, we need to look. And other technique, we say we need a smell. Many smell can tell us is what happened for children. For example diarrhea, we need… Diarrhea has smell. What different smell, we can know. Is the food stagnation or the wind cold or the wind heat or is overeating? This we know, just for example. And we need to ask question.

12:21 S1: Ask question, baby cannot answer you. We need to ask the family, close to the baby one. For example, if mommy always with the baby, we need to ask mommy. With the grandma always, we need to ask, very detail ask, starting mommy pregnant continued right now. Last technique, we need to check the pulses, yeah. Childrens, they have the post technique, but a little different adult, yeah. This important for TCM, for TCM. And at the same time, we need the touch technique. Touch the abdomen, touch the head, touch the hands, touch the foot. We need to know many information. Okay, next. Then, we are… This have more detail. Before we talk, inspection very important for exam. You say ask inspection, you look what, this thing for you. Yeah.

13:26 S1: Especially we looked at the shen. We say the shen, spirit, spirit. If normal children is lot of energy, lot of energy. Look very happy face and shining eyes, right? If sick baby, they changed. The energy is low. The eyes is not much energy, too. Okay? They change a lot. So certainly, the body shape, we need to look. And the tongue, we need to look. The TCM, very important to look the tongue, tongue tissue, tongue coating, tongue shape. Everything we need to look, okay? Then the eyes, we need to look color, red, yellow, white. Is it closed or open? Everything we need to look. And the nose, is stuffed nose, congestion nose, have the mucus, what color mucus, we need to look. And the lips, color important, too. Is lip color red or pale or the purple color? We need to know. Okay. And dry and moist.

14:33 S1: Last technique we need to know, the index finger, blood vessel line. This is special… For the pediatrician, we use over 2,000 year experience. We looked, we know this disease is external, internal. And the light or medium or the danger. If you study pediatrician, we need very detail talk about this index finger blood vessel line can tell us many things. Okay. Specialize. We know only for the use… We treat the patient not only use the Chinese medicine. The important Chinese medicine, we use the internal or external medicine depends patient condition. Right? And we use acupuncture, too. You don’t worry the children can use acupuncture. I use all the time, any age. But technique different adult. We use the special technique treat the patient, treat the patient.

15:42 S1: Then, we use the tuina. Tuina very special. We use a thousand, thousand years. This technique, patient like and the family like because very gentle and treat many disease. And the result, really good result. The both side is happy, is happy. So every case and the three year old major we use and the three year old children, we use not only herbs, not only acupuncture. We definitely use, with the tuina together. Right now, I want to show you how the tuina technique. This video later. Okay. Last technique, we say the food therapy. Food therapy very important. Many different disease, we choice different food, because the deposit. Yeah, if you always eat regular foods, no change. If patient sick, you need to change your food. We can teaching you common cold, for example.

16:50 S1: We say the common cold, we have many different type. Wind cold, wind heat or the deficiency. So, these three type we use the different food. I’ll give you patient suggest. You need to change your regular food. Otherwise, recover, little difficult. This is very important, too. Last one, in the detail, I show you the video for use the tuina treat the children disease. This tape prevention. We have many different kind. We treat the children disease. I can show you other one. Today, I just give you prevention. Prevention children disease, how to use the tuina. Everyone, I can teach in the family, family everyday you can do at home yourself, help the children. Don’t need everyday go to the clinic. Okay. They say is prevention, very good, good result baby like.

17:51 S1: Okay. Right now, we study tuina video. This kai tia men is a Chinese name from the… Yeah. Between the air hole go to the head. Yeah, this the prevention the cold. Very good. Winter time coming, can make the nose, it’s a stuffy nose and the common cold. It’s prevention or the treatment, stuffy nose, common cold is good, yeah. You can use the 15 times more. This we say Kangong Rubing this Chinese name. You can use two finger, you have two of them starting the eyes go to the Tai Yang. These functions, they are prevention the common cold and the treatment cold, too. Very good one. Children love this, you see, their happy face, yeah. This function, low, taiyang…

19:01 Speaker 2: Original one.

19:02 S1: Taiyang, the Chinese name. You see the temple area, this can prevention the common cold, treat a headache, and the eyes have problem, infection. This, just very simple. Use your finger movement. You can move the one or two minutes, is okay. You can put a little, your finger touch little of bit ointment, baby oil. It’s more smooth. This other one, we say the Xin Yi San for the stuffy nose, common cold, still can use two finger move. One minute or two minutes. You can feel right away, open the nose right away, open the nose. Yeah. Childrens, they are very happy. Happy face, yeah. Okay. This is This Mo Xiong is for the infant good, is and the three year old. These for what? For the lung congestion and the heart. Make the heart stronger. Very simple.

20:30 S1: You can put little ointment. This is powder, it’s okay. We use a Hua Shi powder. We can use the baby oil move. It’s one minute, two minutes, okay for the… This one for abdomen massage. Your hands follow the abdomen move. It’s two direction. Both direction, one direction, yeah. This way, other direction too. This is for digestion problem we use, yeah. Digestion, indigestion and abdomen pain or the gas, we can use this function, yeah. Even family can use. You can use lotion, small, or use the baby oil is okay. This we use a Hua Shi powder. Other one is Zusanli this stomach 36, these channel points. Channel points, this help digestion problem and help immune system make stronger, immune.

21:40 S1: If your children, immune system is low, we can use these points. Move two or three minutes. We can use this move. Then the joints move. It’s especially, infant, they cannot exercise. Yeah, you can help. You look this picture, doctor move the arm first. You can move 30 times each or 15 to 30 times is okay, yeah. Then the up. Yeah. You see, follow these instructions. Yeah, childrens, they are very happy, they’re very happy. Then, yeah, turn, elbow turn. In turn or the outside turn. In and out. Later, yeah, you see this out. Each time, 15 times or 30 times is okay. Then the, with turn two. Okay. Both side, inside and outside like this. And the leg, bend the knee. And the hips.

22:57 S2: 10 more minutes.

22:58 S1: Okay. Yeah, inside and outside. Maybe, okay, almost done this way, then the stop. Yeah, this exercise…

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23:21 S1: Yes, this ankle. Okay. We stopped here for the tuina picture. Later, I want to tell you, we are pediatrician. We treat the disease. What kind disease we are often treat? Yeah. For example, we have the ADHD. ADHD very common disease right now. Then nobody really know why happened. The reason why happened. So children try the Western doctor treatment is very heavy, you know, the drugs, some patients cannot handle all side effect, so they come where our office yeah. We try to use acupuncture, we use the ST36 starting points and the body points, mostly we use acupuncture, same like a help, we cannot say 100% help, but we treat a patient’s symptom, yeah reduced, reduce the symptom.

24:32 S1: Especially I suggest patient younger then if diagnosis is early, for example, this disease most that happen easy to find a five year old, or the under the five year old to find it. If for early stage you try to combine together the use of many different ways of your treatment, specially acupuncture I look the patient result, really help so patients they continue coming. This disease that we treat, ADHD, other diseases we look, ADHD picture, everybody know. Other disease we treat acute respiratory infection disease, common cold which I didn’t write down, but common cold very good for TCM.

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25:35 S1: Okay, we almost done, we kind of, every disease talked.

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25:51 Speaker 3: Alright. Thank you so much, Professor. Alright everyone, this is our question and answer time, so if you’d like to please enter your questions in the chat function and the “Go to webinar” box, just click right there and enter your question we’ll get to the answers.

26:11 S2: You can continue play the video.

26:13 S3: And right now just for your entertainment we’ll continue playing the video.

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26:27 S3: Alright. So, we have one first question and it’s from Netta, thank you Netta for your question and the question is, “Professor, how do you treat an infant that has problems breastfeeding?”

26:42 S1: Breastfeeding?

26:43 S3: Yeah, yeah, how do you treat an infant that has problems breastfeeding?

26:48 S1: Mommy no milk, right?

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27:03 S2: Question again.

27:06 S3: Okay. So Professor, how do you treat an infant that has problems breastfeeding?

27:11 S1: Breastfeeding mommy not too much milk, right, is question? Or the infant has a breastfeeding problem or something?

27:21 S3: I don’t know, she didn’t clarify.

27:24 S1: Really? Or I say, if you mommy no milk, we use TCM Chinese herbs, really good result or the food treatment, the food therapy. We give lot different soup, food with the herbs soup, make the mommy, the milk coming. Or use acupuncture too, this makes the mommy coming…

27:48 S3: Oh!

27:49 S1: Yeah, milk.

27:51 S3: Alright. And we have another question from Judy, “What is the most common pattern that is the cause of ADHD?”

28:00 S1: It’s a big question, I think. [chuckle] Ways to how the thinking, is the how to thinking, we say thefirst, TCM thinking kind of, suddenly we think, many after born the baby we TCM is thinking of the four element problem, we say the liver, we say the kidney deficiency, we say the heart, heart is fire, we say the spleen, the spleen deficiency, always we… The treatment, the pattern, the treatment pattern. We have different patterns of liver yong kang, kidney deficiency, or the heart is a fire, or the spleen is a qi deficiency, we use different patterns, we choose different herbs, we choose different points too for this treatment.

28:57 S3: Oh, okay. So there’s different patterns of ADHD?

29:00 S1: Yeah, ADHD. Everyone is different, yeah.

29:03 S3: Alright. I hope that helped, Judy. Okay. Now we have one question from Jamie. “At what age would you start using needles?” Or yeah, “At what age would you start using needles?”

29:15 S1: I use any kind of age before we talked about infant I used, but technique is different, it is gentler, the needle is a special pediatrician needle, then the points choice location is different than adult, they don’t use too much points, few. Any age I use acupuncture for infant.

29:42 S3: Oh okay. And she also asks, “Instead of needles, do you palpate the points to stimulate them, do you do acupressure?”

29:50 S1: Acupressure I use too, yeah, I use. If patient, yeah new patient, especially new patient, they are scared, first time I don’t want to push too much, I say, “Okay. I use acupressure for you, I have the special one, acupressure for baby, they can… ” We provided… Do you understand? We can change the needle. Okay.

30:07 S2: Otherwise you can? Okay.

30:10 S3: Hi Awatif, can you ask your question in the chat function?

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30:17 S3: Oh, okay. So, Awatif asks, “What is a good point to treat ADHD?”

30:23 S1: I use many point, no [chuckle] right now talk, I need the class, we have the special class, talk a lot. I use the head points, skull deep, skull deep points a lot, okay. I use the body points a lot, back shu points and the front chin of four or five element of problem… Follow the… You know the different type of the diagnosis. I chose points, lot of points. These we need to study, yeah. No only a few points.

30:56 S3: Because the ADHD comes from many different areas.

31:00 S1: Yes. Mm-hmm.

31:03 S3: Alright, thank you so much everyone. Do you have anymore questions? If you do so, please just use the chat function. So we have another question. So, Judy… Or the name escapes me. But the breastfeeding problem, the question earlier, the, “How do you treat an infant that has breastfeeding problems?” So it was a problem with latching, meaning the baby can’t latch, it’s not a milk problem.

31:37 S1: Uh-huh. No, mommy no…

31:38 S3: So yeah.

31:39 S1: So baby problem…

31:40 S3: So baby problem… How do you help latch them, when breastfeeding?

31:46 S1: So, I need this… [chuckle]

31:49 S3: How do you help the baby latch on, when breastfeeding?

31:54 S1: Sometimes is mommy nipple problem, you know. Nipple no easy out, I see this kind of case. Yeah, so we need the mommy deliver a baby before. We need a nipple. If you pulling out treatment make it easy the baby, and other baby side… Sometime baby side problem, they have swallow problem. We need to know if they have the congenital disease, because children disease, many congenital disease. The mommy pregnant… What happened? The mouth, the soft milk, they have no power, someone… Sometime, we need a detailed check the baby’s side some problem, so both sides we need to check. Yeah. Who is the major one, okay?

32:41 S3: Oh okay, so I hope that answers your question. Now we’re going on to Jamie. She had the question earlier about ADHD. “For ADHD, would the child have to receive ongoing treatments or would there be a limited treatment plan?”

33:00 S1: I think a long-term treatment. So I give the patient… Yeah, long. Not only a few times.

33:04 S3: Oh okay.

33:05 S1: It’s a difficult disease, I know. Long-term treatment.

33:09 S3: It would be a long-term treatment?

33:10 S1: Yeah, yes.

33:12 S3: Could you say how long? Would it be years, or months?

33:16 S1: Definitely a few months.

33:18 S3: A few months?

33:19 S1: Yeah, maybe half a year or something.

33:20 S3: Oh okay. So I hope that helped you, Jamie. “Have you ever successfully treated lack of speech for a child?” If a child isn’t easily able to speak. Is that what you mean, Sean?

33:35 Speaker 4: Yeah.

33:35 S3: Okay.

33:36 S1: Mm-hmm, I treat for this problem. I know this mostly from the ear problem, their hearing is lost. Congenital disease, the ear both sides, is hearing lost. So never heard people, how they talk. Some patient cannot speech. Speech, right, is the problem?

34:00 S3: Yeah.

34:00 S1: So I treat, seem like a good… Later, my patient can talk now, can talk right now. Before no any talk, because cannot hear it. I don’t know if she’s problem is this problem. You need to check the ear or the other reason… Yeah.

34:16 S3: Okay, so Kaya, if she’s ever successfully treated with Apraxia, it’s often been a hearing problem. Do you know if it was a hearing problem? Okay, we have a new question from Judy. “With infant issues, do you recommend that the nursing mother gets treated as well? That the mother gets treated as well as the baby, when they have just general issues?”

34:44 S1: Yeah. Maybe, yeah, both treatment, but…

34:48 S3: Yeah? Okay. Alright, I hope that helped you Judy.

34:50 S1: Yeah.

34:53 S3: And, I think that’s all the chat questions. Does anyone else have another chat question?

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35:06 S3: Oh! Crystal asks if you can demonstrate the hand tuina for pediatrics. For instance, how to treat organs with tuina on the hand like lungs, etcetra.

35:18 S1: Yeah, definitely. We use the fingers. Sometimes we call it the finger tuina, you know, because…

35:23 S3: Oh okay.

35:23 S1: Yeah, finger tuina, I use the five finger elements. Five elements on the five fingers.

35:29 S3: Oh okay.

35:30 S1: Each finger, different organ.

35:31 S2: Sure, sure.

35:32 S1: I show you for example, this is the lung channel. Okay, this is the kidney channel, this is heart channel, this the liver channel, this is spleen channel. Yeah, five elements all that, your hands.

35:46 S3: Oh okay.

35:46 S1: Yeah. [chuckle] If you want to know, you come my school there, [chuckle] I can more teaching you. [chuckle]

35:54 S3: Alright Crystal, I hope you heard that, if you wanna learn more, that those are the five elements on the hand. I hope that helped you.

36:01 S1: Right.

[chuckle]

36:04 S3: Alright everyone, thank you for your questions. If you have anymore, please go ahead and put it up in the chat function, but I hope you enjoy the video of the tuina massage for the kids. They’re so cute.

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36:31 S1: This is Nie Ji for the back, for the immune system related.

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36:44 S1: This one, two, three year old children how to massage. Mommy that massage for the baby.

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37:10 S3: Okay. There’s a new question from Jason. Jason asks, “Can you give mama herbs to help baby with constipation? And which herbs?”

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37:21 S1: This constipation we treat mostly we use the tuina, tuina massage, really work. Don’t need all the little bit acupuncture, too. Not too much medicine. So, massage really works for this part.

37:35 S3: Oh okay.

37:35 S1: Tuina. We say the tuina yeah.

37:37 S3: Is that the stomach rubbing?

37:40 S1: Stomach rubbing and the back.

37:41 S3: Oh okay. I hope that helps you out, Jason.

37:45 S1: Yes.

37:55 S3: Alright. If there’s any more questions, please just put them in the chat function. All those points help with congestion.

38:07 S1: Yeah, congestion and prevention common cold good.

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38:41 S3: Alright. Thank you guys so much for attending. If you have any more questions, please just put them in the chat function.

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38:54 S3: Alright. So, we have another question from Jason. He asks, “Do Chinese herbs help as much as vaccines?”

39:02 S1: Vaccine? I think… Yes, I think so. Prevention for the wei qi and the lung qi and we use the tuina, too. And the herbs, too, we have. If I treat the patient, always sick children, I use these three way help.

39:21 S3: Oh, that’s cool. So, they do help as much as like a western vaccine. That’s cool.

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39:35 S3: Thank you so much for the questions, Jason.

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39:50 S3: Another question from Jason is, “How long is the tuina treatment for baby?”

39:58 S1: How long, depends the patient condition, disease, different kind of disease. Every time coming, I use this three way acupuncture, herbs or tuina. Every time patient coming, we use these. Combined together, use these three technique, yeah. Depends the disease. Some disease are urgent. Children, if your diagnose treatment is correct, they recover fast. Don’t need too long. If chronic disease, maybe little longer. Last week, yeah, we have the chronic, the always sick baby. Before this, used too much antibiotic, seemed like a bad cycle. So we made the normal cycle come back. We need take time.

40:47 S3: Oh okay. Also, he asks, “What’s the paste on the baby’s belly in the video?” I think its just powder, right?

40:54 S1: Yeah.

40:55 S3: When you rub the baby’s belly.

40:56 S1: This is Chinese herbs Hua Shi powder. We, too, use this okay because at home, don’t have Hua Shi powder. You can use the baby oil or the lotion.

41:09 S3: Oh okay.

41:10 S1: Also can use, yeah. No problem. These Chinese we use the Hua Shi powder.

41:16 S3: And what is that made of?

41:17 S1: To make smooth, because baby’s skin very tender. If you don’t use anything, you touch the skin, No good smooth. Baby make the skin too rough, make the baby no good.

41:33 S3: Oh okay.

41:34 S1: Yeah.

41:34 S3: Is it made out of cornstarch?

41:36 S1: Yes.

41:37 S3: Yes?

41:38 S1: Good. So you don’t this way, okay. Use the oil, it’s okay.

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41:49 S3: Alright. Thank you so much, Professor, and thank you so much for all the questions.

41:52 S1: Alright, you’re welcome. Thank you.

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42:07 S3: A right, thank you guys so much for joining us for our TCM for Pediatrics webinar. This is part of our webinar series. Alright. And in this series we’ll look into TCM and how it can help Americans face the common diseases we face today. Please join us to learn more. Our next webinar, just so you know, is December 14th, and that’s TCM for Depression, and on January 18th will be TCM for Infertility. And our webinars start at 5:00 PM and go ’til 6:00 PM. And just to encourage you, if you have any questions about the webinars before, you can always send us an email and you can get ‘em answered during the webinar. And here on our school website you can go and log in and join up. And you just click here “Reserve your seat in our free webinar and events.” We just need a little bit of information and we can sign you up to join our other webinars.

43:13 S3: Again we have one that’s coming up in December for TCM for Depression and one in January. Also later this week, we have two enrollment info sessions. We have one on November 19th, and that will be both in English and later in Chinese. And then we’ll have another enrollment info session on December 17th, and that will be in English and Chinese as well. Also you can sign up for our other webinars that are coming on later in the year, TCM for Herbology and TCM for Diabetes and TCM for Dermatology. And once again thank you so much for joining us for our TCM for Pediatrics with Professor Lucy Hu. I hope you learned a lot, I know I did, for TCM and how they can help cure children and treat children efficiently and comfortably without too much scary [chuckle] medicine. Alright, thank you so much for joining us, we look forward to seeing you again. Bye.

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